Add missing airports to Nav database?

Hi all, especially jeehell,

is there a way to manually add additional airports to the database?
I'm talking about the (not anymore existing) Kai Tak airport in Hong Kong. Everyone knows the nice scenery of FlyTampa and I'd love to fly there.

Any chance to add the airport manually into the database?

Regards,
Martin

Hi Martin, take a look here http://www.vapap.com/kai-tak-airport

There are manual instructions on how to hack the database, but I've never got it to work. Perhaps you will have better luck (let me know if you do!).

Thanks for the reply. But which of those corresponds to JeeHell? The Level-D Installer?

Read any of the manual instructions on the website - it should key you in what you should do.

I think you need to edit the

\A320FMGS\Navdata\Navdata1\navrecord.dat

and

\A320FMGS\Navdata\Navdata2\navrecord.dat

files -- this is a text file where you can put in the coordinates.

Any luck Martin?

JL -- could we lend a helping hand? I also found these instructions here -- http://www.kennair.com.au/wp-content...HX-Navdata.pdf

Is the JL FMGS navdata database readable with Microsoft Access?

Should we be editing the ARPT.bin file? I would also like to get the Kai Tak coordinates usable by the MCDU.

Thank you.

Hi,

You can add your own navdata inside a file called additional.txt into the navdata1 and navdata2 folders (Server computer only).
Then it is compiled into the bin files which you can redistribute over the network (compilation done after deleting the old bin files of course).
I do not have any documentation on the navdata format used, but you may check the navigraph navrecord.dat to see how it works. This is based on ARINC424 format, not very easy task.

regards,
JL

Cheers, thansk JL -- I had a look at the navrecord.dat.

I've referenced an existing airport -- YBCG (Gold Coast) --
PG|YBCG|YB|RW14|8176|0|148|-28.156511|153.500706|21|140.0|||
PG|YBCG|YB|RW17|1909|0|059|-28.164356|153.506753|17|173.0|||
PG|YBCG|YB|RW32|8176|984|148|-28.172569|153.510920|13|320.0|||
PG|YBCG|YB|RW35|1909|0|059|-28.169594|153.506331|13|353.0|||

I Will try and figure out what this all means --

I'm assuming --

PG|airport ICAO|YB|Runway|runwaylength|?|?|coordinates|coordinates|?|?

Question mark - I still need to determine.

PG entries are "runway entries", and this is the format to use:
PG|ARPT identifier|ICAO code|RWY|length|DTHR|width|latitude|longitude|elevation|mag bearing|LLZ ID|LLZ category|

You need one PG per runway direction.

But you also need one entry for the airport alone, this is a PA entry and looks like:
PA|ARPT identifier|ICAO code|latitude|longitude|elevation|speed limit|speed limit alt|transition alt|name|



And you may need one entry per ILS as well, the PI entries:
PI|ARPT identifier|ICAO code|LLZ ID|category|frequency|RWY|LLZ latitude|LLZ longitude|LLZ mag brg|GS latitude|GS longitude|GS angle|GS elevation|STN DEC|

And then you'll eventually need to code the procedure, but this starts to be really difficult, try to do the runways correctly first then we'll see for procedures.

JL

Cheers JL -- thank you. Will trial this out and provide you with an update. VHHX is a visual approach so we don't have to worry about ILS.

Success! :) Kai Tak, VHHX is now open for duties!

http://www.mycockpit.org/forums/atta...id=10980&stc=1

This is the information I added to additional.txt --

PA|VHHX|VH|22.316667|114.203333|15|250|F100|9000|KAI TAK INTL|
PG|VHHX|VH|RW13|10930|1864|197|22.322177|114.196318|15|136||
PG|VHHX|VH|RW31|10930|716|197|22.305538|114.215179|15|316||

Excellent! Thank you guys! :)))
Could we also try to add the ILS for the IGS 13 approach?
The ILS guides you down to the checkerboard. And there are some NDBs that also come in handy when trying to fly it as published.
Regards

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Maddin91

Excellent! Thank you guys! :)))
Could we also try to add the ILS for the IGS 13 approach?
The ILS guides you down to the checkerboard. And there are some NDBs that also come in handy when trying to fly it as published.
Regards

---

Hi Maddin -- can you provide some more information about the IGS13 approach? We will need raw data.

Is this the data yr after?

http://www.flytampa.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3105

I'll look over it but probably won't have time to test it out until next year. Data reposted over here from the link for easy reference, thank you.

FSX Version

Runway IGS 13

<Waypoint (initial approach fix)
lat="22.3201835504145"
lon="113.991101919016"
waypointIdent="IAF13">

<Waypoint (final approach fix)
lat="22.3255266607098"
lon="114.073851926099"
waypointIdent="FAF13">

<Waypoint (MAP fix)
lat="22.3326390320936"
lon="114.184007813583"
waypointIdent="LDA13" />

<Waypoint (initial approach fix)
lat="N22 19.21102"
lon="E113 59.46613"
waypointIdent="IAF13" />

<Waypoint (final approach fix)
lat="N22 19.53160"
lon="E114 4.43111"
waypointIdent="FAF13" />

<Waypoint (MAP fix)
lat="N22 19.95833"
lon="E114 11.04048"
waypointIdent="LDA13" />

Outer Marker

Decimal
22.326835245
114.092402458

DDM
N22 19.610115
E114 05.544147

Middle Marker

Decimal
22.331539504
114.165248126

DDM
N22 19.892370
E114 09.914888

Runway IGS 13 Displaced Threshold

Decimal
22.322177435
114.196317836

DDM
N22 19.330751
E114 11.779194

Runway IGS 13 Localizer Antenna

Decimal
22.33390756
114.201911688

DDM
N22 20.034454
E114 12.114701

Runway IGS 13 Localizer DME

Decimal
22.321608961
114.195679128

DDM
N22 19.296538
E114 11.740748


FSX Version

Runway 31

<Waypoint (initial approach fix)
lat="22.1882046014071"
lon="114.345829188824"
waypointIdent="IAF31">

<Waypoint (final approach fix)
lat="22.2390519082546"
lon="114.2888648808"
waypointIdent="ALANE">

<Waypoint (initial approach fix)
lat="N22 11.29228"
lon="E114 20.74975"
waypointIdent="IAF31"

<Waypoint (final approach fix)
lat="N22 14.34311"
lon="E114 17.33189"
waypointIdent="ALANE"

Outer Marker

Decimal
22.237970978
114.288787991

DDM
N22 14.278259
E114 17.327279

Middle Marker

Decimal
22.284567654
114.238276184

DDM
N22 17.074059
E114 14.296571

Runway 31 Displaced Threshold

Decimal
22.305538206
114.215178674

DDM
N22 18.332221
E114 12.910952

RWY 31 Localizer Antenna

Decimal
22.326954603
114.190941006

DDM
N22 19.617276
E114 11.456460

RWY 31 Localizer DME

Decimal
22.304784469
114.214619994

DDM
N22 18.287068
E114 12.877200

I'm having a look at the rest of the coding in the navrecord.dat on how to put the above in ....... going to take a while to get it right.



Michael

Alright,

I managed to get all VORs, ILS, DME and NDB into the database working as they should. That's good so far.
Here's the code for additional.txt:

PA|VHHX|VH|22.316667|114.203333|15|250|F100|9000|KAI TAK INTL|
PG|VHHX|VH|RW13|10930|1864|197|22.322177|114.196318|15|136|KL|1
PG|VHHX|VH|RW31|10930|716|197|22.305538|114.215179|15|316|IHK|1
PI|VHHX|VH|KL|1|111.900|RW13|22.33390756|114.201911688|088|22.33390756|114.201911688|3.1|15|
PI|VHHX|VH|IHK|1|109.900|RW31|22.326954603|114.190941006|316|22.304784469|114.214619994|3.0|15|
D |TH|VH|115.500|VDHW|22.239000|114.289001||||||TATHONG POINT
DB|TP|VH|280.0|H MW|22.239000|114.289001|TATHONG POINT
DB|RW|VH|377.0|H MW|22.3265|114.19116666666667|HONG KONG INTL
DB|SC|VH|236.0|H MW|22.32|114.13216666666667|STONECUTTERS

Now I'm trying to work on the procedure, starting with the IGS 13 approach.
Here you can see how it should look like: http://www.flytampa.org/dwl/flytampa_hongkong.pdf (page 3).
That's what I tried so far:

PC|GOLF|VH|I F|?Latitude|?Longitude|VHHX|CH270007
PF|VHHX|VH|I13|A|CH|010|CH|VH|D |V C||||IF||| |||||||8000|0|0||||
PF|VHHX|VH|I13|A|CH|020|GOLF|VH|PC|V C||||IF||| ||||||+|6000|0|0||||
PF|VHHX|VH|I13|A|CH|030|SL|VH|DB|V C||||IF||| |||||||0|0|0||||

"Golf" is the first turning point after leaving CH VOR. Next is SL (SHA LO WAN) but from there you have to do an intercept onto the LLZ and I have no idea how to code that...

JeeHell: Is the approach procedure okay so far relating the coding? Or am I missing something? Can you explain how to put intercepts in the code?

Regards

Thanks Guys, my KaiTak is now alive.......;)
I have just thought about the possibility to adding it to database, and luckily I found this topic created by Martin.
Adding Procedures will be a very difficult task :D However, if we have PBD, we can manually create SID/STARs and put Constraint to each points...

Glad it worked for you.

There's only one problem with the IGS Approach so far (same applies for the opposite ILS approach of RW31):
The ILS is correctly tuned and appears in the PFD. But - because you can't select an ILS approach in the MCDU - the APPR mode of the Flight Director will only capture the LLZ but not the GS. The mode showed in blue is "FINAL" instead of G/S (result of not selecting ILS appr. in MCDU).

So coding the approach is kinda important for the system to work properly.

Hi Maddin,
I suggest to Turn off A/P and fly the airplane manually :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Hi Maddin,
just having a look a the new PI|VHHX entries you have done ,for the new VHHH they end in W2.0 which I'm presuming is the magnetic variation? should we b adding tis o VHHX?


Michael

Hi

i'm not a fan of letting people code procedures themselves. Please before you start going that way, get some information on ARINC 424. This is not easy. I don't like letting out that information and do support on that, I really do not have the time to.

Regarding ILS, if you don't enter a runway in the MCDU, I believe pushing APPR on FCU should arm G/S and LOC modes as long as an ILS frequency is set. If not, I will have a look.

Now is time to do raw data flying...

JL

ARINC format http://olravet.free.fr/ARINC424-18.pdf

pls remove if this is not to be publically available. I just googled it.

Kai Tak OM & MM

PM|VHHX|VH|KL| OM|RW13|22.326835|114.092402|
PM|VHHX|VH|KL| MM|RW13|22.331539|114.165248|

I created additional.txt file to put code in, then placed to both navdata1,2 folder and recompiled bin files. However VHHX is not available.
Then I edit directly the navrecord.dat file to add VHHX code, building bin files, and then VHHX is now alive :mrgreen:
I have Just made some touch and go with raw data, manual thrust & manual flying the IGS ... feeling GREAT ! :cool:

Glad the code worked for you.

It's weird though. The additional.txt works fine for me. The problem when using the navrecord.dat is, that after an update of the Navdata (no matter if Navigraph or Aerosoft) this file will be replaced - so your code is gone and you have to insert it again. This has to be done after every update then.
additional.txt is not touched by an update - that's what it's for.

Thanks Martin I got the point
I dont know why, at first, I use txt file, however after bin created , txt file disappeared from both nav1,2 folder...VHHX not there.

Maybe some code was corrupt in your additional.txt - maybe happend while copying from the forums.

Attached is my file that worked for me.
Regards

Thanks a lot Martin, I will try again with your file and report back later :)
Cheers,

Cheers, will try this out when I get back in Jan.
We can try and work on programming SIDs and STARs next :)

Hi to all,
perhaps I´m too blind to see the difference:
I have success adding VHHX to the Database with the following text (THX JeeHell, OmniAtlas, Maddin91!) to "additional.txt":

PA|VHHX|VH|22.316667|114.203333|15|250|F100|9000|KAI TAK INTL|
PG|VHHX|VH|RW13|10930|1864|197|22.322177|114.196318|15|136|KL|1
PG|VHHX|VH|RW31|10930|716|197|22.305538|114.215179|15|316|IHK|1
PI|VHHX|VH|KL|1|111.900|RW13|22.33390756|114.201911688|088|22.33390756|114.201911688|3.1|15|
PI|VHHX|VH|IHK|1|109.900|RW31|22.326954603|114.190941006|316|22.304784469|114.214619994|3.0|15|
D |TH|VH|115.500|VDHW|22.239000|114.289001||||||TATHONG POINT
DB|TP|VH|280.0|H MW|22.239000|114.289001|TATHONG POINT
DB|RW|VH|377.0|H MW|22.3265|114.19116666666667|HONG KONG INTL
DB|SC|VH|236.0|H MW|22.32|114.13216666666667|STONECUTTERS

But I fail to add LSZA (which I want to use when flying ToTom´s A318 with the following text:

PA|LSZA|LS|46.0015|8.9092|915|250|F100|6000|LUGANO|
PG|LSZA|LS|RW01|4429|361|98|45.9995|8.908167|896|17|ILU|1
PG|LSZA|LS|RW19|4429|673|98|46.008167|8.9125|915|197|ILU|1
PI|LSZA|LS|ILU|1|111.5|RW01|46.011708|8.914225|17|46.011708|8.914225|4.4|942|
PI|LSZA|LS|ILU|1|111.5|RW19|46.011708|8.914225|17|46.011708|8.914225|4.4|942|

Does JH recognize the Airport is too small? Adding a faked too long RWY length does not make any effect, whilst VHHX is recognized with the short RWY length of LSZA as well.
THX for any help!

I believe Lugano is already in the DB, but removed because of the original length of the runway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeehell

I believe Lugano is already in the DB, but removed because of the original length of the runway.

---

Seems to be the same with EGLC.
Does that mean the short-rwy-airports are not removed by A320 FMGS, but by the Aerosoft data base, so only chance would ne to get the Aerosoft database adapted to an (steep approach equipped) A318 as it is for Aerosoft Airbus Extended A318? In that case I could ask if Aerosoft could adapt that database for JeeHell with ToToms A318, too (I know you only support the A320 and sure I understand and accept that!).

Checked it now with the Aerosoft busses. They all (A318 to A321) have LSZA as well as EGLC in the database. So the problem should not be caused by the Navdatabase. Is there any chance to configure the mechanism that removes the airports with the short runways?

How long are those runways?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeehell

How long are those runways?

---

LSZA: 1420 m = 4648 ft (o.k., T/O not authorized, we will have to bring him to LIMN on the highway :) )
EGLC: 1508 m = 4947 ft (T/O authorized with normal load)
Todays Topcat calculation for a Bizjet A318 (LX-GJC) sparely loaded with 6 PAX + Baggage (Landing Weight 42234kg, Tailwind 1kt) gives Landing distance Required (LDR) (for LSZA Rwy 01) 1167m = 3828ft (at Landing distance actual 700m = 2300ft).
Therefore a suitable limit of shown Airports in the MCDUs database would (to cover cases of emergency) in my opinion be 1000m /3300ft.
THX in advance!

I will decrease the length a bit in next version, but this is highly unrealistic. 1000m long is really not suitable even in emergency...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeehell

I will decrease the length a bit in next version, but this is highly unrealistic. 1000m long is really not suitable even in emergency...

---

THX! No prob, I won't use a 1000m runway, I'm fully satisfied when Airports like EGLC and LSZA are possible, and sure not with an A320, but with the A318. THX for that nice XMas present and your incredible support!

Problem solved with B 44.2 - THX JL and have a merry XMas!

Hi all,

is anybody able to add runways and any procedures for amazing old QUITO airport???

Thank you

Jiri

Hi all,
I have spent a few days updating the Kai Tak navaids and waypoints. I advise that you backup your original.

I'm trying to add the SID/STARS in but this is going take awhile to work out.

Any problems let me know.



Michael