Also note that it looks like PM teamed up with PMFlight
http://www.mycockpit.org/forums/cont...genta-pmFlight
SO... you have hardware FDS teams up with software Sim Avionics, and software PM team up with hardware pmFlight.
Interesting!
Matt
Printable View
Also note that it looks like PM teamed up with PMFlight
http://www.mycockpit.org/forums/cont...genta-pmFlight
SO... you have hardware FDS teams up with software Sim Avionics, and software PM team up with hardware pmFlight.
Interesting!
Matt
pmFlight is ProjectMagenta Same company, this is their Flight Simulator division. Using their own software, the same as being sold to us.Quote:
Originally Posted by my737sim
Matt Olieman
According to PMflight the software in their own sims is based on what is available to the public but is in fact highly customised with many additions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Olieman
I think you present a valid point and yes I'm aware what it says, but I'm telling you, the software is the same which is available to you and me, the same software package PM is selling to the public. I hope that clarifies that statement.Quote:
Originally Posted by johnwayne
I don't know anything about FDS/Sim Avionics software and I will not argue which one is the better. I don't know. But if I have facts contrary to what I read here I will comment.
I think it's wonderful to have a choice of products!!!!!
Indeed, more choice means more options for everyone. Its really great to see how much is available now. X-plane is doing well. Too bad Aces was canned, but I believe some of the former employees formed their own company. (Although I have not heard any update on that in months)Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Olieman
Matt
Thanks Matt , Im trying to decide between the 2 packages at the moment. It seems there is a lot of information good and bad available from many sources on PM and lesser so on SIMA , this of course is natural as SIMA has a much lower user base and little to none in the professional arena which could serve as a flagship. I can only though relay what was stated to me by PM themselves which is that there are additions in their own package based on custom requirements and it took PM software engineers months of work to configure the PMflight Sims. I was left with the impression that PM was very hard to install and hard to configure to the extent that It might be better to pay high fees to have them do it for me. What information I have gathered on SIMA has been on the whole positive , especially in installation and configuration although if this results in a " dumbed down " aircraft I dont know. I am still trying the demo of both.
Hi Johnwayne,
I just saw this and as I look at your lcoation, it seems you are not so far away from me.... at least relatively compared to the other members <G>, so maybe we might have a chance to exchange views on this more closely.
I will not postulate my personal views about PM here as this is obviously not desired. Suffice it to say that I have been a user of PM from the very first days and that I own 3 (three) more or less complete licenses of PM - 2 for B and one for A. Of which the A one is - of course - in use in my A340 project. If someone came along with some longer term perspective and credible promise to develop further for an airbus application I would switch without a second thought.
PM me if you want further information or assistance.
Erhard in Thailand
The software is around 1700 USD now :mad:
How was it before FDS messed-up with Sim-A ?
Hahaha kind off Gwyn but no one would figured a raise of more than 200% this is just crazy.
FDS come on give us a break
This IS crazy. I am very angry and disapointed about that new pricing too.
Tested SA with my brand new OC MCP and EFIS for 2 weeks and programmed SIOC till all units work and then they change the price from one day to another. Too much for me now.
And the question for me is "for what ?"
1400 € and more for a (for this high price) very small program which is still buggy here and there.
I.e. If I would buy for whatever hardware for that price and would find a malfunction or defect I would
claim and ask for my money.
Sitting here with my new hardware nearly 2000 € and wonder what to do now. The good price of SA was the impulse for me to start cockpit building. Never think about a price-change that high.
I think my last option is PMDG and FSXpand now.
So thumbs down for that kind of extortion. :x
I still haven't had a quote from FDS despite 2 requests, but I have a general idea of the situation from the other posters here.
Of course, any supplier can take a decision to set their price to what they think the market will bear, so it's my problem if I don't like their decision :)
There has to be a question mark over whether FDS/SA made the right decision in this case. They could have announced a final chance to buy at the old price: this could have brought in a number of new users (or those like me who had been testing demo's for some months and were ready to jump) - which in return would have increased the number of potential customers for FDS harware (which must have been the reason FDS chose to team up with SA in the first place). Now instead unfortunately, many of the potential buyers may not buy the product at any price, as they feel they have been let down. I seem to remember PM started cheap, but gradually got more expensive, but with plenty of warning.
Just for the record, I had the pleasure of meeting the two very nice guys who are SA at the SimFest round the world fundraiser last year. They both had "real "jobs, wrote the SA software in their spare time, and had their home built simulator in Dad's garage. So we aren't talking SA Group Megacorp here :)
Still, I'm very sorry the way things have turned out. Bad decision by someone.
--
Bryn
Bryn,Quote:
Originally Posted by brynjames
just to clarify my thoughts..."give credit where credit is due" (thanks to LEO.org :) they did a great job in writing this software. And I think its ok to sell their product to a company. I think we all would do the same if we have the chance. Its FDS who make the new prices.
--
Kai
Quote:
Originally Posted by brynjames
Bryn,
According to FDS Blog the Sim Avionics original guys are now working full time and have delegated the sales , marketing and primary support to FDS. That is to say in this current economic climate they gave up their secure job to work full time on the software . This could lead to major development in this package if its done correctly. FDS in principal have a good product line but if the service is poor it takes a lot of the appeal away , the last thing anybody at this price level is into is having to "keep trying" to spend money with a company , that part at least should be very easy. I suppose a certain amount of latitude has to be cut because its a new arrangement though but as you say its frustrating not getting your emails answered. I am still waiting to see what comes of the FDS/Sim Avionics relationship , hopefully something happens soon so I can make an informed decision between both companies.
That's a bold step indeed!Quote:
Originally Posted by johnwayne
Thanks for the heads-up to the FDS blog: it makes interesting reading, and explains a bit more about the thinking behind the moves.
Not that I agree with his conclusions of course :)
Anyway, I wish the SA guys well in their new venture - even HP started in a garage.
--
Bryn
Hi all,
I thought I should set the record straight so to speak as there is now quite a lot of conjecture and speculation about the merger of Flightdeck Solutions and Sim Avionics. All this speculation leads to feeding the rumour mill and all of a sudden there are a dozen theories going around about why it happened! I feel the need to speak in defense of a fellow vendor! These are my own views as a vendor and not the views of the MyCockpit management!!
Many of us, including myself have been quite disappointed by the news of the price increase of Sim-Avionics, we have missed the chance to purchase it at the introductory price. It was available for quite a while and we have all had our chance to purchase it cheaply so our complaints will achieve nothing and I ask the membership to have a think about what can be achieved by attacking the vendors!
I have been in contact with Peter Cos and we have been discussing the merger. Peter does follow our forum threads and he is very well aware of all the rumours and disappointment amongst the members who want to buy SA. The basic facts are - Peter sincerely believes Mark has got a great product in Sim-Avionics and it is much better than it's competitor's products. He has "reached out" to elevate and further develop the product with Mark. If Mark is able to quit the day job and work fulltime on SA, then surely this will benefit us all by speeding up the process of completing the product successfully. Peter Cos has not "bought out" SA for his own benefit, FDS is well and truly a successful business in it's own right and he could easily employ a software engineer to develop avionics for him. Peter is offering assistance to a team with a product that he believes will already be the best available product and his motivation is 'getting it finished and out there'. The price increase is pitching the product where ultimately, it should be!
Building a cockpit flight simulator is an expensive hobby and we all part with many bucks creating our sims. I have had many potential throttle customers complain about AUD$3,800 for "just a replica throttle" but they don't see the 70 to 90 hours of labour that goes into producing over a hundred components of a replica TQ. They don't see the countless hours of producing CAD drawings in order to make the components. This is the same deal for all hardware vendors, there are countless hours that go to producing simulator hardware for what is very much as niche market. If you can't afford a professional working replica throttle then make one yourself, it's as simple as that. When we think of simulator software, we presume it easy to replicate into a downloadable format, the work is done so it cost practically nothing to reproduce. The truth is, the work is never done and development continues via the efforts of these very talented software engineers.
When our simulators are built and we have spent somewhere between 10k and 100k producing the replica cockpit hardware, should we skimp on the software that makes it live and breathe? The avionics is it's brain and connects it all together. This is Peter's view and I've got to agree really from a vendor point of view. We all have the choice to speak freely and complain if we want to but all the complaining in the world won't change the price of a product but it might harm the relationship between a vendor and the potential market that our forum holds for him/her. If it is too expensive for you to buy then you have to find a cheaper alternative, that is the top and bottom of it! The growth of this hobby will ensure that alternatives appear and I'm sure we will see some healthy competition.
I hope we can all learn to appreciate a bit better what these people are trying to create for airline companies, training facillities, aircraft manufacturers and eventually us, the hobby enthusiast. There is a bigger picture but we are all bound to benefit from these types of development.
Regards,
Gwyn
(Same comment posted in the other current SA thread)