737 or Avro Rj(Bae146) Project?

[Timmi]

Fresh out the shop Premier Aircraft BAE146-100/200 or RJ 70/85 Their VC isn't much to look at but then you are building your own. They are usually quite meticulous when it comes to modeling and the exterior model looks quite good. Definitely worth a look see...

Cheers
Ron

Ah nice Ron. But I'll think I stick with the Eurowings PRO model. Aerosoft is allso making a avro rj but it won't be released untill next year. About the cockpit poster I ordered there was some trouble with the delivery but I should expect it next week they said. I have started drawing something to work with to make a shell for the cockpit pictures will come
Btw what scale or is the picture of the cockpit you sent me here in the thread?
Thanks Ron and see ya soon/ Tim

[Ronson2k9]

You mean the drawing of the cockpit or the cockpit I did the measurements from. I didn't post the pic. I can find if for you if you like.

This is the BAE RJ Flightdeck photo I used for the cockpit measurements.

There are many others on there for photo ref but you need one that is nearly flat to measure from. Then I took one of the smaller instruments to use as a ruler.

[Timmi]

You mean the drawing of the cockpit or the cockpit I did the measurements from. I didn't post the pic. I can find if for you if you like.

This is the BAE RJ Flightdeck photo I used for the cockpit measurements.

There are many others on there for photo ref but you need one that is nearly flat to measure from. Then I took one of the smaller instruments to use as a ruler.

No I mean the pic you posted here Wanted to know what scale it was so that I could Measure the windows to make a shell. I have got in touch with Routech so the BAe146 yokes is ready to go. But how did you manage to measure from the picture like "1 inch on the pic is like ...inches in real"?

Thanks/ Tim

[Ronson2k9]

On the drawing of the RJ each pixel (smallest graphic square) is 2.5 inches or 63.7mm. Remember though it's the biggest drawing I could find. For the MIP measurement (photo). I took one the smaller instruments in the photo. Knowing that it's a standard size and used that as a ruler to measure the mip with. I tried to find data on the larger instruments (so I could use that instead) but couldn't find anything on them. Honeywell is very protective of their info (probably a left over of 911). The one piece I did find although preported (by Honeywell) to be in the RJ I couldn't find a single example in any of the photos I had seen.

Okay.. If it we me building the RJ sim pit..

I would wait till I got the MIP poster (not sure if you ordered the 1:1 version) but that will be the most accurate piece of info you have. Then from there move outward. Keeping in mind the following pieces of info.

- the MIP is angled slightly away from the crew (about 5-10 degrees) others may have a more accurate idea of the angle. I should think it's pretty common.
- the cockpit is smaller (more closed in) then the drawing would indicate. As you have molding (walls) and storage on the interior. There are many photos on airliners.net that show this.
- before you build the windows give some thought to your visuals (projector/LCD screen). As that will be what you want to see. If you have the space for a full mockup then a projector(s) could be in your future. If not though you may want to stop at the MIP and everything aft of that and build your visuals accordingly.

On the actual aircraft the windows are pretty huge so if you aren't using a projector then your LCD's will look kind of small inside that space. In the flightsims of old. They were built (Link trainer - first flight sim) to teach instrument usage. Even now visuals are pretty much a bonus and not really a requirement.

Okay that said I have picked up some more info for you and I've got a line on a FCOM if/the site it's on comes back up. It's currently down but the last cached version was only a day ago so could be back up soon. I did find an RJ Troubleshooting Guide (used by maintenance personnel). If you shoot me your email address in a PM I'll send the one off to you and when/if I get the other I'll send that too. The RJTSG doesn't have dimensioned drawings but does go through the cockpit layout and what procedures are used to test equipment. I'm sure some of those are used by flight crew as well. In some instances though you have to have access to exterior of the aircraft to check it (not going be crawling around the outside during flight hehe).

Cheers
Ron

[Timmi]

Yees that's the problem I ordered the wrong MIP poster so I canceled the order and the 1:1 scale MIP poster cost's 410 dollars and that is a bit to much in swedish curency so I dont know what to do really. Maybe I'll cancel this project and start a 737 project instead. So I don't know really. I have allso tried to get in touch with BAE systems but no sucess. I will try to work something out and see what I can gain.

Thanks/ Tim

[Ronson2k9]

You wouldn't need to do that. So long as it's accurate. You can get the scale of the MIP so long as you know the size of one of the items in the poster. Or the poster may contain the scale on the image. I had emailed them but they didn't answer my question about the scale of the poster. The poster has many advantages over using photos. It is to scale which can easily be determined. There are no items that would obstruct the view of the image and it is truly 2 dimensional. BTW the BAE_RJ FCOM isn't currently available from the site I had mentioned above. I did get on yesterday but all they have from BAE is the Jetstream 41 a twin turbine commuter. Not a bad bird BTW but not the RJ.

In the poster. Some of the items won't be able to be used as a scale as they could be custom made for the aircraft. However there are some standard items that can. All you need do is find one (which I had already done) and you can scale the poster. It's much like knowing the width of a door in a house and then using that as a scale for all the other items in drawing. In a photo it's a bit rough as the scales are smaller (it's a photo after all) and the accuracy requirement is pretty high.

So a somewhat small photo with small details going to a large object is not going to yield 100% accuracy. However in a poster - That's a drawing - which came from another drawing so it's accuracy is as best your going to have.

With me I was working with parts catalog of the Cessna 185. That didn't have dimensions at all and I combined that info with that of a known items (gauges) and was able to make a pretty well bang on scale drawing. I have no access to an actual aircraft but for me it will do what I want it to do. It may be off a little here and there but the essence is there and without actually measuring a real one would be hard to tell the difference. Still there is some guess work in it. You have to dig a bit though to get all you have to find.

Now you aren't going to find such a catalog for the RJ as it would be the size of a phone book hehe (if it exists in paper form). The best you can hope for if not able to get into a flight deck (or finding someone that has/could do that for you) is the poster/photos. Then you work with what you do know. I still hearken back to the BAE Panel Project. While it was built to fit as much as possible into the 2D panel as the flightsim could hold everything is where it should be. Even the stuff that couldn't be simulated at the time is there.

Given the recent cargo scare getting BAE info could be difficult. However there is quite a bit of free info already out there.

So I wouldn't give up. I didn't on the Cessna .. There wasn't even a good model for the flightsim when I started the project. I would still get the poster (the cheaper one). You can then scale that up. There are a few ways to do that via computer or even manually. Then it's just a question transfering to full size 'wood' or other material you're using for your MIP. That is where I would start BTW.

MIP is the biggest priority Then
Flight controls (should be as close to real thing as possible)
Then avionics
Then overhead
Then Visuals (exterior).

With the poster though that is the key. It will give you the dimensions to build everything else. Even if you have to find the scale yourself it's just a bit more work. Hey I'm still here helping you. So should be able to nail this down it's just going to take a bit of time.

Cheers
Ron

This BAE RJ100 photo is much better then the previous one. It looks to be center and below the autopilot. Perfect for making measurements with.

[JWS]

Tim,

If you start a project like this, it's vital that you don't give in easily when things are going a bit less fast of easy. Judging by the amount of info that you already have (courtesy by Ron) you should be able to start something. The photo of the flightdeck gives me the impression that the standby instruments look very much like the ones in the 737. Now there's a start because these measurements are available. And find someone who can get you into a cockpit with a tape measure (or let him do it).

Success,

JWS