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  1. #1
    10+ Posting Member ph-yos's Avatar
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    PMsystems vs PMDG

    Goodday all,

    Just surfing around the net and visit a lot of websites from homecockpitbuilers, like Ians' and Stef etc, I stilol have a questions. Well a lot but that is for later. For now there is something that really push me of the track. Lost in the forrest of information haha.

    If I will use PMsystems for my PFD do I still have to use PMDG becouse of the flightcaracteristics, the so called .ini-file? PMDG can also be used like Ian Sisson did. Altough he changed to Project Magenta too.

    The same for the overhead, Can I use the PMDG software instead of PMsystems. Or..., is there a big differnce in possibilties. Really confused here.

    Thanks in advance all and..., happy landings and take care,
    Yos, the Netherlands

  2. #2
    2000+ Poster - Never Leaves the Sim Trevor Hale's Avatar
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    Re: PMsystems vs PMDG

    If you want to interface the overhead panel and switches and annunciators you will need PMSYSTEMS. if you don't want the annunciations, you can get away with just the PMDG.

    I used the PMDG for the flight dynamics only. I stripped all the panels out of it.

    Trev
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  4. #3
    10+ Posting Member ph-yos's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Re: PMsystems vs PMDG

    Thank you so much Trevor. That was what I meant, now my thoughts are confirmed, for this moment I'm not lost anymore haha, well, for this moment.

    thanks again for your quick reply, happy landings and take care,

    Yos, the Netherlands

  5. #4
    25+ Posting Member vcimmino's Avatar
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    Re: PMsystems vs PMDG

    For what you are aware of Trevor, the PMSystem does only work for Airbus and Boeing of it's just a flowing circuit software and thus can be used for any airplane? (Obviously supposed that you are able to create a config for it).

  6. #5
    500+ This must be a daytime job ian@737ng.co.uk's Avatar
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    Re: PMsystems vs PMDG

    hello yos.........
    you wrote "PMDG can also be used like Ian Sisson did. Altough he changed to Project Magenta too"
    oh no i didn't
    my favourite right now for my upgrade is Sim-Avionics.
    what i did was devised my own system using FSUIPC and hard wiring all the annunciators so all the right lights come on at the right time. you see i'm just a poor welsh lad who's two favourite words are free and cheap
    and there's more......all this hard wiring can now be replaced with IC's. the prototype is working. now it's a case of tidying it up and making it smaller. we're bringing a demo board with us to lelystad.
    have a great day captain ... regards ... ian
    Mr. Ian. P. Sissons is hereby recognised as an Honorary Flight Sim Captain following his passing in February 2016. This is in recognition for his commitment to Flight Simulation.

    www.mycockpit.org Featured Builder August 2008 www.737ng.co.uk
    FS9/PROSIM737/CPFLIGHT/Lots of BU0836X's and a Beer Fridge

  7. #6
    75+ Posting Member MartinK's Avatar
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    Re: PMsystems vs PMDG

    Hi Yos,

    A few weeks ago I was wrestling with the same question as well (see this post: http://www.mycockpit.org/forums/show...y+wrong+add-on)

    Project Magenta (in my mind; anybody correct me if I still don't understand it) has it's own logic for PFD/ND, Overhead, etc. FS, when using Project Magenta is only used as the scenery generator.

    With PMDG the problem is that the company keeps their internal logic very close to their chest such that even FSUIPC can't get to it. What that means is that if you flip a switch on your physical overhead, no matter what I/O card you are using, that action will NEVER be injected into PMDG. In other words: if you manage to get a nice overhead panel constructed and you push the battery switch to get your pit started PMDG will NOT see this so the simulator software will stay cold & dark.

    Now, there is some light at the end of the tunnel. I had some excellent input from Ian Sisson. FSUIPC now has a so called mousetrap macro utility. In a few words, this will allow you to convert a physical switch or rotary action into a simulated mouse action. Just take a look at Ian's website where he explain this in all detail.

    If you need more detail, just let me know.

    Regards,

    Martin
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  8. #7
    2000+ Poster - Never Leaves the Sim Trevor Hale's Avatar
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    Re: PMsystems vs PMDG

    Quote Originally Posted by vcimmino View Post
    For what you are aware of Trevor, the PMSystem does only work for Airbus and Boeing of it's just a flowing circuit software and thus can be used for any airplane? (Obviously supposed that you are able to create a config for it).

    PMSYSTEMS, is Logic based programming, and therefore can be used for any aircraft type.

    Trev
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  9. #8
    2000+ Poster - Never Leaves the Sim Trevor Hale's Avatar
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    Re: PMsystems vs PMDG

    Think of Project Magenta, as a aircraft instrument panel. you inject it into the aircraft you are flying in flight sim.

    Thats the best analogy.


    Quote Originally Posted by MartinK View Post
    Hi Yos,

    A few weeks ago I was wrestling with the same question as well (see this post: http://www.mycockpit.org/forums/show...y+wrong+add-on)

    Project Magenta (in my mind; anybody correct me if I still don't understand it) has it's own logic for PFD/ND, Overhead, etc. FS, when using Project Magenta is only used as the scenery generator.

    With PMDG the problem is that the company keeps their internal logic very close to their chest such that even FSUIPC can't get to it. What that means is that if you flip a switch on your physical overhead, no matter what I/O card you are using, that action will NEVER be injected into PMDG. In other words: if you manage to get a nice overhead panel constructed and you push the battery switch to get your pit started PMDG will NOT see this so the simulator software will stay cold & dark.

    Now, there is some light at the end of the tunnel. I had some excellent input from Ian Sisson. FSUIPC now has a so called mousetrap macro utility. In a few words, this will allow you to convert a physical switch or rotary action into a simulated mouse action. Just take a look at Ian's website where he explain this in all detail.

    If you need more detail, just let me know.

    Regards,

    Martin
    ________________________
    Trevor Hale

  10. #9
    75+ Posting Member MartinK's Avatar
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    Re: PMsystems vs PMDG

    Hi Trev,

    I like your way of explaining what PM is (I needed a lot more words ).

    But, if you will allow me I'd still like to add the following:
    It is still a software based simulation of the physical hardware with the ability however to connect that hardware using the available I/O cards on the market.


    Question from my side:
    If you have PM (the full product) in combination with PMDG: (FSUIPC cannot send data to PMDG to reflect e.g. the flipping of a switch other then through the mousetrap utility) do the PM people have inside knowledge regarding the PMDG internals through which they can or am I still missing bits of the picture?

    Thanks,

    Martin
    2.6 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo E7200 3 GB Mem ATI HD 3650
    Vista/FS9.1/PMDG747/UTEurope/MEGAX Frankfurt/Cloud9 EHAM

    Flying is easy: move the stick forward - houses get bigger. Pull the stick back - houses get smaller again

  11. #10
    500+ This must be a daytime job
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    Re: PMsystems vs PMDG

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinK View Post
    If you have PM (the full product) in combination with PMDG: (FSUIPC cannot send data to PMDG to reflect e.g. the flipping of a switch other then through the mousetrap utility) do the PM people have inside knowledge regarding the PMDG internals through which they can or am I still missing bits of the picture?
    As already stated, you must consider PM as a replacement instrument panel. You cannot use PM and the PMDG panel at the same time. Not only do they not talk to each other, their attempted actions in FS, on the aircraft model, will conflict.

    The only sane way of using PM with a PMDG aircraft is to strip the latter of its panels, i.e. effectively to have an almost empty PANEL.CFG file. In mine I only have the external views configured there. Then there's no PMDG logic conflicting with PM logic. Maybe you can find ways of using some parts and not others, though I don't think I'd trust any such hodgepodge.

    This really only applies to the 737NG that PMDG did for FS9. That's the one I use in FSX. I think that the more recent models aren't separable in this way, that if you remove the panels you lose the proper use of the model too.

    We are hoping that PMDG's forthcoming (one day ...) 737NG for FSX will be more amenable to use with PM than their 747 and MD11 efforts.

    Regards

    Pete

  12. Thanks ph-yos, MartinK, Matt Olieman, Trevor Hale thanked for this post
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