How far should it tilt

[Doon1]

Hi Guys,
I'm new to this forum. I have a small flight chair set-up now that can be seen here http://forums.flightsim.com/vbfs/sho...d.php?t=193685 I ran across first the skyflyer and then found thanos' website (very cool). So I've decided to build my own.
I've gathered most of the parts I need to build my platform but I was wondering just how much tilt i should build into it. I'm currently designing it with 60 deg. of movement (30 deg each direction) but could go less or more as needed.
John

[autocadplease]

The more the better - obviously! But in real life commerical pilots usually try to keep all banks to 20 degrees or less - for passenger comfort. 30 degrees each side should be good. I would think anything beyond that gets to be a problem in design / construction?

Love your setup too!

[ANDYSMITH]

As long as the "ball" is in the middle you will not need any side tilt during an even rather steep bank angle as there is nothing to simulate. From my two rides in a real sim the most you will feel is aout a 45 degree nose up on takoff roll to simulate LOTS of power on accelerating, and it feels like it is really pinning you back in your seat. And roughly the same for braking on landing, nose down about 30 degrees. Other than that not much movement at all. Big shudder when the wheels touch, constant minor shaking to simulate turbulance.But no side tilt unless uncoordinated flight.
Andy

[Doon1]

Thanks guys,
I got my flight training about 20 years ago. I remember doing 30 deg. turn around a point manuvers. There was a lot of tilt feeling while going into and coming out of the turn but there was also some while in the turn (bubble centered).
I just fly GA in FSX but I also fly IL2. Hopefully 30 deg will be enough. If not then I can (fairly easily) modify it to add extra rotation.
Several years ago I designed a chair that had 360 deg. rotation on both axis' but that would probably be overkill.
John

[Doon1]

Not to mention cost prohibitive.
John

[Roland]

Andy is right:

Allow bigger pitch angle for more acceleration feeling. Ian's site (buggies build for fun) has some explanation about the physics behind the tilt angles.
Roll angle can be much less, unless you plan to do a lot of high-speed steering on the runways.

[Doon1]

Thanks Roland,
Ian does have a great site. I've been there several times over the past year or so. I even downloaded the plans for his first platform that mounts to a wall. There's a nice piece of work.
My goal is to keep the entire platform under 26" wide. I will have sliding outriggers that will be deployed to maintain lateral stability whilst flying. I guess I'm undecided as whether to build a 3 point actuator platform that has heave or build a single universal joint platform that I can build with the junkyard parts I already have. The junkyard has an "everything you can carry for $50" day the first Sunday of each month. The single point system would require less part fabrication and uses no wooden parts which is a plus in my book. Heave vs. ease of fabrication. I just don't know. If anyone has experience with both types, 3DOF and 2DOF, I'd love to hear from you.
John

[Matt_Thomas]

Yes, like everyone is saying pitch is more important than roll (tilt). In normal coordinated turns in real airplanes you don't find yourself leaning against the door very much.

However, I think some roll movement is important. Personally, when I stand outside and watch a 2 DOF simulator, it just feels like a lot is missing. I just expect to see the thing tilt right and left a little, even if I know it's not 100% realistic.

[Roland]

Some roll tilt angle is definitely required. What's important to realize is that during most aircraft manouvres, there isn't a lot of sustained lateral force. (Driving circles on the taxiway would be an exception, where the continuous centrifugal force would keep pushing push you sideways).
The funny thing about a fully enclosed motion sim with good visuals is that your brain is easily fooled: you don't need a lot of platform motion to get a good feeling of acceleration, aircraft roll, ect. So when you look at a motion sim from the outside, it seems it is not doing a lot. However, the people inside may have a completely different experience, as they have no outside reference, and good visuals will do a lot to enhance the feeling of motion. Bigger platform movement easily leads to wrong cues, and these will quickly lead to unrealistic aircraf feeling.

So less platform movement is often better than too much.

[Doon1]

Hi Roland,
I have really enjoyed your site. Very informative. It seems as though your platform doesn't have a lot of tilt yet, like you said, it seems as though the effect is very realistic. How much tilt does your platform have? I didn't that find that spec on your site.
John