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  1. #1
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    Breakthrough in motors?

    Ok,

    Haven't been around for a while, but have been lurking and thinking. Pretty close to STARTING my actual project. Had an idea while laying in bed tonight, would CORDED drill motors work?

    pluses I can think of:

    1) They are all reversible
    2) You can get them with decent torque/amps
    3) They should be pretty durable because of their designed use
    4) Best of all they are easy to find and cheap

    Anyone else have comments? This is just a brainstorm, so I haven't thought out too much.

    So these could be used instead of wiper motors, right?


    Greg

  2. #2
    500+ This must be a daytime job Jim NZ's Avatar
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    Drills

    Hi Greg,
    You got my vote on this one ... Great idea

    You wouldnt be able to use steering boxes though due to the back-force problem (No worm gear in a drill) BUT if you coupled a drill to a reduction gearbox that had a right-angle worm drive in it ... Your away laughing.

    Great thought !!!

    Jim NZ
    www.jimspage.co.nz
    www.jimspage.co.nz/intro.htm
    All this and Liz still loves me ! !

  3. #3
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    Any idea where I maybe able to find a gear reduction box?

    I don't think I seem to be understanding the whole backforce/worm gear problem. Got any diagrams laying around?

    Maybe getting a couple of washer motors and using the gearing part with a drill motor would work?

    Greg

  4. #4
    500+ This must be a daytime job Jim NZ's Avatar
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    backforce

    Greg, Worm drive reduction gearbox's are very expensive and that is the killer.
    To give you an idea of what they are http://www.penfold.co.nz/products_wormgearmotors.html
    Worm drive box's generally have the input shaft at right angles to the out put shaft.
    You can turn the input shaft and the output shaft will rotate (Obviously) but if you try to turn the output shaft,,, the input shaft wont turn.,, if fact ,, nothing will turn.
    This is what we need to overcome the backforce.

    Backforce is where,,, imagine the sim is stationary, no power is going to the motor, you are in the sim and there is weight down on the drive/gearbox or whatever. It must stay in its "stopped" position and not force the motor to go around and hence ,, the platform would drop or roll. We dont want the motor to be "forced" to go around with the weight on it.

    In my setup, the steering box is not a true worm drive but it does restrict the force going backwards thru it. The rest is held in the stopped position with the worm drive that is in the wipermotor gearbox.

    just while you are laterally thinking all this, one thing I didnt research because I live miles from the coast,, was what sort of drives were on those capstan winchs on yaughts etc ??? If they were worm drives then depending on rev's,, load,, etc then they could be a possability... MAYBE !!! Still cost though, dont they.


    mmmm Washing machine gearbox's .... Dont know Greg .. sorry... there are a million different types.

    Hope this is of help ... Jim NZ
    www.jimspage.co.nz
    www.jimspage.co.nz/intro.htm
    All this and Liz still loves me ! !

  5. #5
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    Yes this helps a lot. I had that idea about the backforce, but wasn't sure.

    My whole idea is keeping this relatively simple and inexpensive, just as you have, otherwise I would have gone the stepper motor/gear motor route (ouch=cost).

    My thinking here about the drill motors is the higher torque and rpm compared to the wiper motors for quicker response (remember I am building this for a fighter).

    Wiper motors are fairly inexpensive here in salvage yards as well as the steering boxes, So.... do you think it is possible to just disassemble the wipermotors and adapt a different motor to it for the worm gear setup?

    Greg

  6. #6
    150+ Forum Groupie Roland's Avatar
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    Keep in mind that most electric motors with gearboxes cannot handle quick reverse action like needed in motion platform.
    In this thread http://forum.racesimcentral.com/showthread.php?t=225439 you can read how someone damaged both gears of heavy duty electric scooter motors due to sudden torque changes.
    A softstart like Jim implemented could save the gears, but would reduce the quick surges that fighter plane motion would need.

    Roland
    www.simprojects.nl

  7. #7
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    Roland,

    I saw your site and have to say that I am very impressed, you have accomplished a lot. I see the video you made, it looks like your doing what I am trying to do.

    Yes I did see that thread about what happened with the scooter motors. I was thinking that the drills would be strong enough to handle that kind of abuse, maybe I am wrong.

    Another thought would be to just make a soft-start sim... thinking... SOME motion is better than NONE???

    I'm just determined (as well as you all) to figure out an economical way to make this work, without spending $15,000 on a commercial sim platform, which does EXACTLY what I want...

  8. #8
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    Hi all
    For my two bobs worth I have followed one of jims sugestions.(Thanks Jim) I have been mucking about with a power steering pump linked to an old ford power steering box with a wiper motor driven from a pwm unit and it is a winner so far ,cheap and reliable . With most of the load being carried by the power steering unit and not the wiper motor it is sure to give the system a fairly low maintenance agenda . I have only one axis operating at the moment and with my 95kgs of rear end on it it is about 2.5 seconds for a total 48 degrees of pitch which is more than twice the value most of you require . this speed can be increased as I am only driving the pump with an old 1/4 hp 240 ac motor out of an old concrete mixer with the belt reduction the pump is only doing about 350 rpm.
    I will put a larger motor on soon with a larger drive pulley and will expect a fair increase in platform speed Iwill do some load tests on the power steering when I put some more hp into it and post the results if anyone is interested.
    .
    The bit that I dont seem to be able to come to grips with so far is how to get the multiple monitor setup to make a smooth transition between forward ,forward left and left can anybody fill me in on a few tips on what to do?
    Regards Bish
    Now where did I put that bloody screwdriver

  9. #9
    1000+ Poster - Fantastic Contributor AndyT's Avatar
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    Power Winch Drive?

    I posted a while back that I had thought of using power winches for my drives and I was hoping someone would comment on this. They can handle a tremendous amount of weight and they should be able to interface with the steering mechanisim fairly easily. (I hope! )

    I have no idea if they have the problem of 'backlash' but I would'nt think so. They also have the advantage of having the center spindle already setup for mounting a gear. That makes it easier to adapt them for higher speed simpits such as fighter jets and the like. They could be chain driven or direct link or direct gear mesh.

    Comments PLEASE?!

  10. #10
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    car jacks

    Hi guys

    i am new on this forum, not so in pit building

    Wonder why nobody using car jacks as i platform lifting devices--they are very cheap , common, and containing screw gear

    As well pheumatic jacks could be interesting for this purpose

    Just an idea

    regards

    Joseph

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