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  1. #1
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    Potential buyer: VNAV problems, A/P problems?

    Dear PM staff and users,

    I am a potential buyer of your software. I am considering building a 737, however I have been reading this forum and have become alarmed regarding the problems facing the current autopilot build. It appears that Vnav is not working, and given that I love to fly via the correct real-world instrument procedures, I feel that this would not be acceptable. Therefore, I am asking if you have any intention of fixing VNAV and other critical autopilot functions in order to simulate the real thing. It is disheartening to see that other desktop sim companies seem to excell at this. Given the un-realistic performance of Vnav and other A/P functions (i.e, overspeed on descent, un-realistic mode changes, etc that I have read here) I will wait to see if this is resolved before making my decision to buy.

    Does anyone know if the problem is being worked on?

    Does anyone know if AST for airbus has a properly working A/P and LNAV/VNAV? If this is the case, I may have to change to airbus and go with AST despite my love for Boeing.

    Thanks All
    Aqua

  2. #2
    1000+ Poster - Fantastic Contributor Bob Reed's Avatar
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    Keep in mind this sort of post needs to be emailed to PM support as well as PM does not frequent this forum. It is a users forum.
    Bob Reed

  3. #3
    500+ This must be a daytime job mauriceb's Avatar
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    Just my 2 cents here. Despite all the outstanding issues with PM software, you can still have a blast with it even with all its limitations. Yes, it would be nice if all was working as it should, but you can still fly around the world with it as is. In some ways, it is even good to get around its limitations by following manual procedures, so, as a somewhat biased PM user, I would still say go for it now if you can afford it.

    Also, as I found out on many occasions, the faults were PEBCAK (Problems Exist Between Keyboard And Chair) . I blamed PM several times when it was my fault all along.

    Maurice

    Disclaimer: The opinions stated here are mine alone and not necessarily those of this organization, nor of those who frequent it. They are not meant to offend, harass, belittle or otherwise upset anybody in any way, shape or form and I regret profusely & apologize in advance if anything I said in any way, at any time or to anyone caused distress to anybody or could have caused distress after they thought about it for a while.

    There, that should pretty much cover it . And I really got to stop this & get some work done on my sim. As many people seem to know, Boeing's really require regular maintenance.

  4. #4
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    Thanks, however I know that not having a proper working Vnav/Lnav system would, for me, defeat the purpose of putting so much into a new simulator. As i said, I like to fly using instruments, especially using the various A/P modes. Thats the main thrill for me.

    I would hate to shell out so much and have no assurance that anything will ever be done to address the autopilot issues. I really wish someone from the staff would address these concerns. Has anybody gotten a recent response on the VNAV bugs?

    That is why I am asking if its worth going the AST route. If anybody has experience with its a/p, please inform me if it acts normally.

    I believe it would be prudent for PM to address these issues, as for many, the issues would scare away potential buyers and help the compeition.

    Thanks
    Aqua

  5. #5
    1000+ Poster - Fantastic Contributor Bob Reed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 737aqua View Post
    Thanks, however I know that not having a proper working Vnav/Lnav system would, for me, defeat the purpose of putting so much into a new simulator. As i said, I like to fly using instruments, especially using the various A/P modes. Thats the main thrill for me.

    I would hate to shell out so much and have no assurance that anything will ever be done to address the autopilot issues. I really wish someone from the staff would address these concerns. Has anybody gotten a recent response on the VNAV bugs?

    That is why I am asking if its worth going the AST route. If anybody has experience with its a/p, please inform me if it acts normally.

    I believe it would be prudent for PM to address these issues, as for many, the issues would scare away potential buyers and help the compeition.

    Thanks
    Aqua
    What are you using to fly now? Is AST doing a Boeing software?
    Bob Reed

  6. #6
    25+ Posting Member
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    Nope, I'm just a desktop flyer right now...but I'm seriously considering building a cockpit for the 737, however if software dictates a better experience on airbus, I may have to switch preferences.

  7. #7
    500+ This must be a daytime job mauriceb's Avatar
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    Aqua,

    I don't know about LNAV/VNAV issues with Airbus and since you are thinking about AST, it looks like you are talking Airbus. All I can tell you in that in the Boeing's, the LNAV/VNAV problems are really not that big an issue in my experience. I did do a flight around the world in a Boeing using VNAV & LNAV in real time & with real weather and I lived to tell about it

    But if you want 100% functionality & no bugs of any kind, then you will be very disappointed of course. But I don't think you will find anything that is even close to perfect except the multi-million dollars simulator software and even that is not perfect.

    Again, I'm talking about PM software & Boeing's. This could be much worse (or better) with Airbuses, so Airbus folks would need to chime in here and relate their experiences.

    Maurice

  8. #8
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    Thanks -- No, I do not want PM's Airbus software. I would only use AST Airbus software or PM's Boeing software. As I said, I will choose an aircraft to build based on the best software available. I do not want to build a 737 and end up with poor software.

    Maurice, that is good to know, but why arn't the staff working on a fix for the VNAV bugs that everyone has talked about on this forum? Isn't the autopilot the most important part of the systems to work on for them? The overspeed bug on descent sounds very bad.... and there are more in the VNAV problems post.

    Does anybody know if there are any other choices for 737 systems that work better?

    Thanks
    Aqua

  9. #9
    500+ This must be a daytime job mauriceb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 737aqua View Post
    Maurice, that is good to know, but why arn't the staff working on a fix for the VNAV bugs that everyone has talked about on this forum? Isn't the autopilot the most important part of the systems to work on for them?

    Thanks
    Aqua
    I'm afraid only PM can answer that one. And as I said, the autopilot works fine for the most part. I just learned to get around its limitations and I'm sure that eventually, these will be resolved as well

  10. #10
    Executive Vice President, MyCockpit


    Matt Olieman's Avatar
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    Maybe it's my misunderstanding, I didn't think the VNAV issues were that big of a deal. There were some instances where "goto direct" while in flight caused some system lock ups. It was situational, if I remember correctly, otherwise I don't recall it being a major problem.

    I agree with Maurice, there certainly are many other ways of automated flight rather then just VNAV. I personally never had a problem with VNAV.

    Except for this past year, I've used Airbus PM for almost 5 years and am very satisfied. I do understand there are still improvements to be made, which I trust PM will.

    Aqua, in the end, it's your decision.

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