Circuit Breaker Simulation

[Tom_G_2010]

I'm at the point in my 172 build where I'm finally starting to assemble the lower instrument panel to include of course the circuit breakers.

5864

So I decided I would reach out to others on the forum to see what you had done in this area. Here are some ideas I'm tossing around and may in fact use a mix of them but I'm really up in the air about this.

Install the original breakers for looks only as dummy breakers.

Actually use some of the original breakers as live circuit breakers for the simulator power supplies, dc motors, servos, etc. The type of breaker used in the Cessna are available in a variety of voltage/amperage ratings.

Fabricate or purchase some dummy look alike breakers just to fill the unused spaces.

Purchase some simulated breakers like those from Simkits but I still haven't figured out what I can trip using FSUIPC offsets.

I've found some push button switches that look a bit like the breakers and could install them as camouflaged switches to handle some sim functions from within the cockpit.

5865

Am I missing any ideas? What have you done? Any tips or tricks? In particular does anyone have any information about what I might be able to do with FSUIPC offsets.

[pilotwannabe]

Hi Tom

It's interesting you should mention circuit breakers. This was one thing I was looking at recently, purely for the authentic look rather than being functional, at least to start with.

Simkits offer a very expensive (IMHO) circuit breaker for use with FS here (http://www.simkits.com/product.php?prodid=235) - Here is the Brochure (http://www.simkits.com/brochures.php)

I found these (http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/TE-Connectivity/W57-XJ2A22B10-10M/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtOvozo%2f%2f68GIUkVsaMf50VrjrqTlpS3ms%3d) on Mouser from TE Connectivity at about 1% of the cost of the Simkits ones.

After a bit of modification, I'm sure it could be triggered easily enough by a method I have as yet not looked into. As I said, for me, it was purely for the look, but I'm sure some of the brains on this forum would be able to suggest something workable. I'm not sure about FSUIPC offsets - I had a quick look but didn't see anything, but again, it wasn't something I was too bothered about.

Hope this is useful. Good luck with it, and best wishes

Colin

[AK Mongo]

Tom,

I was thinking along the lines of option 4.
"I've found some push button switches that look a bit like the breakers and could install them as camouflaged switches to handle some sim functions from within the cockpit."

No idea how you would get others, or Simkits to work. Their forum and instructions don't have much info that I could find about how to trip them.

[Tom_G_2010]

Tom,

I was thinking along the lines of option 4.
"I've found some push button switches that look a bit like the breakers and could install them as camouflaged switches to handle some sim functions from within the cockpit."

No idea how you would get others, or Simkits to work. Their forum and instructions don't have much info that I could find about how to trip them.

The switch in the picture is slighter larger in diameter than a standard breaker and sticks out of the panel quite a bit more but with the white button and application of a number on the end they make for a fairly convincing breaker look alike. I found them on Leo Bodnar's site and will also be checking on domestic sources as well if I decide to go that route,

[Tom_G_2010]

Hi Tom

It's interesting you should mention circuit breakers. This was one thing I was looking at recently, purely for the authentic look rather than being functional, at least to start with.

Simkits offer a very expensive (IMHO) circuit breaker for use with FS here (http://www.simkits.com/product.php?prodid=235) - Here is the Brochure (http://www.simkits.com/brochures.php)

I found these (http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/TE-Connectivity/W57-XJ2A22B10-10M/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtOvozo%2f%2f68GIUkVsaMf50VrjrqTlpS3ms%3d) on Mouser from TE Connectivity at about 1% of the cost of the Simkits ones.

After a bit of modification, I'm sure it could be triggered easily enough by a method I have as yet not looked into. As I said, for me, it was purely for the look, but I'm sure some of the brains on this forum would be able to suggest something workable. I'm not sure about FSUIPC offsets - I had a quick look but didn't see anything, but again, it wasn't something I was too bothered about.

Hope this is useful. Good luck with it, and best wishes

Colin

Agree on the Simkits price, it's way off the scale. As for tripping real breakers, no real need for modification. If I go that route I'll purchase the lowest possible rating breakers and use a phidget relay board to feed power to them with a load resistor that provides just enough current to trip them.

The bigger question in that scenario is: What if any electrical failure info can I get out of FSX via offsets to indicate an event.

If an electrical failure event output isn't available I was also looking at reading the bus current offsets and via FS2Phidget and setting a threshold to trigger the breaker trips. The question in that scenario is will the bus current offsets ever show an over current situation and on the flip side what offsets can I then send back to FSX to create the appropriate failures action in the sim.

[notgotaclue]

Hi,
Maybe I am lazy but it seems a lot of work for very little reward, I would go for

Install the original breakers for looks only as dummy breakers. ....then again those mouser electronics ones looks affordable

Has anyone actually purchased the obscenely expensive Simkits breakers?
On a side note - aint it great kitting out an ACTUAL plane for flight sim use.
I am loving it and it gives you something that building a shell will never give you - THE SMELL....... Old aluminium mixed with ground in grease - lovely...
Allan.

[Ronson2k9]

The model would need to have provision for the breakers to work. That is if the model doesn't completely model the electrical system (some do but most don't) then you would have breakers that are just sitting there looking pretty. You could perhaps build a circuit and tie that into to the sim to simulate a popped breaker or the effects of a breaker that is out. The instructors station (http://sites.google.com/site/luisgordo2/instructorstation). Could simulate electrical failures but don't know if that info could be sent to a breaker or not?

You would need it to 'pop' though.

Miniature Linear Solenoid (http://www.ledex.com/miniature-solenoids/miniature-solenoids.html)<= Company is in Ohio.

There are times when a breaker needs to be 'opened' to do something I don't know how you could pop a real 'aircraft breaker' without an overload. This while important for real aircraft perhaps not so good with a bunch of home bench computers in close quarters.

So Just from a build it yourself standpoint.

- Need to get the 'simulated breaker' to blow or operate in the sim first
- Need to be able to send that signal to a built version of a breaker (could perhaps use real breaker or home built one)
- Need to be able to send breaker location back to the sim (for times when you want to turn the breaker off yourself)

If you haven't already, get your hands on a Pilots Operating Handbook (POH) / or owners manual depending on the age of the aircraft you are building. There is detail on when and what to do in the event of failure and use of the breakers when you need to 'operate' them. That will till you if simulating there action is worth the work.

Personally I would go with option 4 or 2.

In my case. Even though a main hydraulic pump (landing gear) failure/recovery requires to open the landing gear pump breaker (for emergency gear ops). I still don't want to simulate that all that much. If I did I could have a SPDT push button do the trick. Push off to keep the simulated EGP from operating when it's closed. Hey maybe that could work for you as well? Just trying to think outside the box sort speak... What if you used a push button instead of a breaker.

- Push click (closed) Push click (open) or better yet a lighted push button. I don't know if the breaker lights up when open or closed. Probably closed (popped breaker = no light). Perhaps one of the real pilots here can help us out on that one? Don't really need the sound of the breaker popping as you would have your headset on and wouldn't hear it anyway. Aviation headsets block nearly all exterior noise from your ears. So that just leaves the lit state of the breaker and it's subsequent usage. A simple relay could be used like a switch between the push button and the signal from the sim. You would need to be able to read the condition of the relay (breaker location) so a third switch.

I'm probably over thinking it I'm sure. Interesting topic though.. I'll ponder some more and see what my brain can chew through..

Cheers
Ron

[Tom_G_2010]

The more I ponder this the more I think there's room for all the options to fit in.

My thinking at this point is that the majority of the breakers will be dummies just for looks. I'll clean up some of the exiting breakers I got with the fuselage for that.

A couple may end up as live breakers for the cockpit power supply outputs. I've found some on aircraft salvage web sites, and seeing that mouser has some as well this is a viable option. I have a pc power supply to feed the various components in the sim and may use some of the breaker positions as part of the protection.

There are a couple sim functions I may want to access from the cockpit that make the camouflaged switch idea a good option. Things like push back or pause for example. I hate the idea f having a mouse and keyboard, even a hidden one in the cockpit so any button functions I can camo' in to reduce the need for that are of interest to me.

And, yes even though it's rare event and FSX has limited failure functionality I would really like to be able to simulate electrical failures that blow fuses. Even if it's only one or two master bus fuses. Although that could turn out to be quite a project in and of itself. Still trying to find offset info on electrical failures...

Ron, thanks for all the thinking out loud, that's some of what I was looking for. Making a breaker pop, real or simulated is easy and I've come up with a couple different ideas. However, you raise some good points that Ill have to dig into further. I don't believe the type of breakers found in a GA aircraft like a Cessna can be opened manually. Looking at the one I have I don't see a way to do it. But I'll pull out the POH tonight and see what it says. If I can get the correct I/O offsets via FSUIPC I'm pretty sure I can do almost anything related to this through FS2Phidgets using a Phidgets I/O card and Relay card. Again, the electronics and the phidgets scripts are not too difficult, iT's those darned offsets that have me stumped though.

Detecting the close of the breaker is also doable and could be sensed by a phidget board. Again though it's the offset input back to FSX and triggering the correct behavior in the sim that I need to figue out.

[Ronson2k9]

I think from an electrical failure standpoint. It could be as easy as turning a display off. This could be done just by having it function like a real breaker. You could also use a relay to trigger the bus failure or power to avionics failure. I always like things that are sim related but work outside of the computer control. In this case..

- Computer would trigger the failure via 'The Instructor Station' software or FSX perhaps.
- That relay could then kill the power to your avionics.

A relay is like a circuit breaker accept that it will work from an impulse not necessarily an overload. If you play with model trains like I do you would get the idea. A relay can turn stuff on or off it's a switch that could be triggered via push button or other electrical signal. It's a remote control switch. This is the good part though it can be triggered by you (turn it on or off) and could also be triggered by the computer. The micro solenoid is an example.

The power needed to run your simulated avionics perhaps requires that it be handled in a more physical way then via electronics. The power passing through the electronics could cook the electrics if it was brought to bare at once (similar to a real aircraft's Pre-Flight). In a sim though it can be more basic as you are only simulating the action not having the real action .. If that makes sense. This process is done in Model Railroading a bunch of times.. (long story).

Think of a second switch between your master avionics and your avionics. This switch is your 'Breaker'. You can trip this via your pulling the breaker yourself or via your computer output. Push button on your panel 'Simulated Breaker' reverses the action. This is only to the display though not to the electronics generating the display. A breaker is essentially a switch that is triggered via overload. In our case it's a switch that is triggered via computer simulated overload (electrical impulse).

This could also be generated outside of the computer via a random timer circuit (hour meter). That would perhaps be more random then a real world (aviation event) but could get the point across and be outside of human control. Which is also a good thing. If you knew when an event like this was going to happen then simulating it is basically you telling the computer to trip the breaker when it should be more random then that. This almost seems like another job for Leo. A card for the breakers to simulate their action (via USB). Then you could drive that via a module inside FSX. This module would have event times and so on. A sim within a sim. Also you could pick and choose what event and what breakers are effected so it could work with any aircraft.

Take a gander at the Instructors Station (previous post)

I have a few more links for you.
Aviation Circuit Breaker FAA Directives (http://aviationglossary.com/aircraft-systems-definitions/circuit-breakers-and-alerting-devices/)
Gamin Circuit Breaker Operation Guidelines for check ride (PDF) (http://www8.garmin.com/manuals/G1000%3ANon-AirframeSpecific_GuideforDPEsandCFIs.pdf)

You should perhaps take a look at the manual and or contact the builder of your aircraft 'most likely Carenado' and see to what extent the electrical systems are modeled. There is also the built in failures in FSX that could possibly trigger this event via FSUIPC.

So need to find out what can be done inside the model then FSX then from there what you could do outside of that. If you think of your aircraft as a real one then as far as the sim is concerned you could work the breakers without any sim intervention. Your sim (FSX) is an information delivery system. The breaker just turns some of that info off. It wouldn't effect how the aircraft operates to a degree only how you operate the aircraft.

Cheers
Ron

[geneb]

Here's a bit of info for you - "real" simulator breakers are the same as non-simulator breakers. The trick is that they're rated for 250mA. The rating on the face of the breaker is a simple decal. Klixon manufactures these. You might be able to score some on eBay.

g.

[Tom_G_2010]

Here's a bit of info for you - "real" simulator breakers are the same as non-simulator breakers. The trick is that they're rated for 250mA. The rating on the face of the breaker is a simple decal. Klixon manufactures these. You might be able to score some on eBay.

g.

Those look good but it would have to be an eBay find for sure. At $60 retail each the Klixon 3SB (http://www.carbonbrush.com/klixon3SB.htm) turns out to be more expensive than the SimKits stuff.

Nothing on eBay at this time but I'm adding them to my saved searches.

Thanks!

[Ronson2k9]

EBay - Lot of 12 (12 units) Klixon Circuit Breakers current bid is $50.00 (http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Klixon-Circuit-Breaker-MS22073-1-7274-11-1-1-amp-LOT-12-/270863443152?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f10b824d0)

[geneb]

It turns out I was wrong on the rating. I checked one of the units I've got and it's rated at 1/2 amp. I did find a source for 3/4 amp breakers here: http://www.protravelgear.com/hanger10/products/3%7B47%7D4-AMP-KLIXON-CIRCUIT-BREAKER.html They're $21 or so.

You could use the 1 amp breakers that Ronson2k9 found if you use your output solution to drive relays that can in turn be used to pop the breakers.

g.

[jonesthesoftware]

Hi
check out a company called ETA they make cb's that look just like aircraft style but cheaper (around$10 each for 0.5 amp) check this link and then look for your local distributor.
http://www.hubelectronics.co.uk/products/circuit-breakers/high-performance
regards
geoff

[Efe Cem Elci]

Any development in this regard guys? I'm also looking into options for doing my C172 panel CB panel using real circuit breakers.

[jonesthesoftware]

Hi
do a websearch on "pop out circuit breakers" there's lots of options from $4.50 upwards. Buy the smallest current version if you are going to trip them with relays
regards
geoff

[Louie Mendez]

I just want to share these circuit breaker replicas that I recently fabricated. They don't work as breakers but function as spring return switches.

http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd462/northbaypic/DSCN3380_zps09941426.jpg

http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd462/northbaypic/_MG_9440_zps95736342.jpg

http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd462/northbaypic/DSCN3270_zps3d2557ea.jpg

http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd462/northbaypic/IMG_5415_zps48e8c327.jpeg

[Tom_G_2010]

I just want to share these circuit breaker replicas that I recently fabricated. They don't work as breakers but function as spring return switches.





http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd462/northbaypic/DSCN3270_zps3d2557ea.jpg



Louie, Any chance of getting them on a click on / click off style switch? One of the momentary switches you showed as, I assume, the switch before adding the breaker look alike button to it, is available in momentary of click on/off configurations. I am thinking about an aircraft I was in a while back that had both styles of breakers in it, the black and the white, and I have this layout in mind that would use the white capped breaker buttons as you have them in momentary and the black capped as click on/off.

[Louie Mendez]

hmm? I never thought of making them in latching style but I can work on it.

[Louie Mendez]

Hey Tom,

I have sent you a PM I'm unsure if you have received it.

Louie

[Tom_G_2010]

Hey Tom,

I have sent you a PM I'm unsure if you have received it.

Louie

Very Strange... I have not received any pm's from you since the one a couple weeks ago about monitor sourcing. I sent you a PM about an order I want to place and a handful of questions about some of your products. Did you receive that? Was your PM a response?

We might need to move the conversation over to e-mail if the PM's are not getting through.

[Louie Mendez]

FYI I received both of your PMs and replied twice.
Please go to my contact page and we'll take it from there.

[Tom_G_2010]

FYI I received both of your PMs and replied twice.
Please go to my contact page and we'll take it from there.

I sent a message via the contact page on your web site a few minutes ago. If you could respond back to my e-mail there by doing a cut and paste of your pm replies that would be greatly appreciated.

[Louie Mendez]

....:mrgreen:

[cptdjb]

I realise this is an old post but have you considered these?
http://www.ruscool.co.nz/ann_dcb.html#dcbs

[AK Mongo]

Those are pretty cool if you are going for window dressing.

[xplanematt]

I am actually in the middle of pondering this myself on my sim. I have a unique opportunity to do something cool, because my Sabreliner cockpit still has every single original circuit breaker from its service days. This is actually very important, because it also has all the original wiring in the cockpit, driving a bunch of original gear (mostly all the lighting, but also mach warning clacker, GPS, instrument vibrators, even the two remaining inverters). So, my breakers are actually protecting their original circuits! I had the clock die on me when the instrument inverter freaked out and sent some sort of spike (or sag?) through the entire system....after that, the clock's breaker would pop after a few seconds! Very cool to be sitting in the cockpit and hear that little "pop" sound. :) (Although sourcing and paying for another original Davtron clock was not so cool.....)

Anyways, I've decided to go ahead and remotely pop breakers from an Arduino. I am using a 50amp 27vDC power supply for all the 28v stuff and will soon have a 120 amp PSU for 5v lighting, so all my little breakers will be easy to trip without over-current on the power supplies (in fact, if I tripped every single CB for the 5v lighting at the same time, I would only have to exceed 58 amps). But some of the big stuff like the 60 amp #1/#2 inverter CBs (on the 28vDC circuit) will need to either be replaced with little CBs and re-labeled, or simply left alone.

I will probably manually trip breakers from the instructor console, though I suppose I could write failure profiles that pop breakers at specific intervals to simulate an overheating component, for instance (so resetting the CB would only work for a few seconds before it pops again). But detecting the failure should be fairly simple....use a relay or opto-isolator on the load-side of each CB to figure out if it's getting power or not.

Anyways...if you are starting with no CBs, I would get low amperage surplus CBs (1/2a would be awesome) for the stuff that is software-only. Ebay has aviation CBs fairly cheap, especially if you can find something like a complete sub-panel that happens to have a bunch of CBs on it. Individual CBs can be picked up pretty cheaply if you are patient, I had to buy a 7 amp breaker the other day after breaking one in my Sabreliner. But you might actually consider figuring out your electrical loads and using the CBs to actually protect stuff, especially if you have any real 14vDC aircraft parts in the sim (probably all the stuff on your Cessna is 14v).

Fun stuff!

Matt

[dagoston93]

Hi,
I know it is an old topic, and hope still someone can help me.
I really want the circuit breakers to work in my cockpit as in the real plane.
So I read this whole topic, but still don't fully understand it.
I would control my switches and etc by an Arduino MEGA microcontroller and use X-Plane.
So after I read the topic, I am thinking about to buy such breakers, as mentioned before:

http://www.mouser.co.uk/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=W57-XJ2A22B10-7Mvirtualkey57100000virtualkey571-W57-XJ2A22B10-7M

I wonder if the would pop out if I simply make a sort circuit between the two pins of the breaker.
Because then I could connect one pin to gnd and one to the + and a digital i/o pin. The i/o pin could monitor if the breaker is on or off.
And then I could connect the two pins to each other with a relay between them.
And the relay could connect also to an i/o pin and get power from the controller(or other source, depends on how much power it needs). And when the sim outputs that the breaker should pop out, the relay can activate making a short and the breaker would pop out.

Is my imagination correct?
If not, can someone please tell me, how it should work?
I saw in earlier posts, that people mention these breakers and relays together but didn't understand exactly how, maybe i missed sth out.

Thanks in advance :)

[Tom_G_2010]

The breaker will not open when shorted as you describe for two reasons:



Your circuit as I understand it has no voltage applied to the breaker just a dry conact from a relay.
Even if you had voltage available. A short across the breaker would remove it form the circuit and it would see no current at all. Basically the far opposite of what you need to pop a breaker.


If you contruct a circuit that applied enough current to the breaker to pop it and you were to use breakers in the actual values needed in a typical GA aircraft you would be playing with some significant currents that are dangerous to both you and your electronics. I would caution against that!

It would be safer to use the lowest rated breaker available and alter the buttons lable to look as if it is the real value. But even at that unless you have a breaker with a set auxilary of dry contacts you have the problems of letting your software know the condition of your breaker unless you add some current sensing electronics to mmonitor your breaker condition.

I still plan to add breakers to my sim at some future point but, for the reasons stated above, I am looking at the cost of commercially made simulated breakers and comparing that to the cost of fabricating my own simulated breakers. In either case that would allow me to trip them at current and voltage levels much closer to logic level and therefore safer. And, I could add dry contacts to allow my arduino board to sense the condition of the breakers.

[dagoston93]

Thanks.
Then i think, temporarily i will use simple switches and later i will find out, how to replace them.
I am already thinking how i could make my own designed fake-breakers :)
Thank you for your helpful answer :)

[BrentonSpear]

Do you guys know what the specific font is that are used on the cessna breakers?

I am going to print some up.

[hyamesto]

Depends of breakers manufacturer. Arial is a choice.

[xplanematt]

Just a quick note on tripping breakers and high currents....

As I understand it, the "big sims" just use all 1/2 amp CBs with different labeling on them to match the real aircraft. This keeps currents low. It also should not be hard to run the CBs to inputs and still throw whatever current you need to them so that they trip. I'll probably have to use a lot of original (big) CBs in my Sabreliner, but if I can find a bunch of 1/2 or 1 amp CBs, I may try to use those, and take the button heads off my originals.

Matt

[crossaint]

Remember that these circuit breakers sniff for current, not voltage. So you can run them from the lowest voltage in your system that delivers the required (over-)current. Think of the 3.3 volts of the PC power supply and a 5 Ohms resistor in series to the C/B. When the relay closes, the current will be 3.3volts/5Ohms = 0.66amperes. That's nothing to the 3.3 volts power supply rail, but the C/B, rated for 0.5, will pop soon. For faster response, use a 1ohms resistor...

For feedback, put in parallel to the load resistor an optocoupler's LED and a 100 ohms in series. As long the C/B did not pop, the 3.3 volts are present and 20mA will go through the LED.

If the 3.3 volts power and your logic share the ground, simply use the 100 ohms resistor to feed the voltage into the (TTL) logic input. It will read "low" as long the C/B did not pop and "high" as soon it did.

[Atomic_Sheep]

Remember that these circuit breakers sniff for current, not voltage. So you can run them from the lowest voltage in your system that delivers the required (over-)current. Think of the 3.3 volts of the PC power supply and a 5 Ohms resistor in series to the C/B. When the relay closes, the current will be 3.3volts/5Ohms = 0.66amperes. That's nothing to the 3.3 volts power supply rail, but the C/B, rated for 0.5, will pop soon. For faster response, use a 1ohms resistor...

For feedback, put in parallel to the load resistor an optocoupler's LED and a 100 ohms in series. As long the C/B did not pop, the 3.3 volts are present and 20mA will go through the LED.

If the 3.3 volts power and your logic share the ground, simply use the 100 ohms resistor to feed the voltage into the (TTL) logic input. It will read "low" as long the C/B did not pop and "high" as soon it did.

I read that they pop worth overvoltage also.

[crossaint]

I read that they pop worth overvoltage also.

No, they can't even sense the voltage. They pop if due to overvoltage the current gets too high.

[blueskydriver]

Hey Guys,

This seems too be a popular subject lately...I posted over on www.cockpitbuilders.com (http://www.cockpitbuilders.com) about how the flight simulation community needs to come together and thereby, making CB's usage possible. A few folks have shown some examples and I believe some of you here have posted there already. For those who haven't go checkout the link below; I posted a few pics of how to make the CB's on/off detection by using a micro switch...

http://www.cockpitbuilders.com/community/index.php?topic=6501.msg46480;topicseen#new

John

[crossaint]

I am using a even less mechanical challenging method. I use a normal push button - those that you get as radio button assembly - and remove the latch The APLS version has a nice 1mm hole in the push rod, so I don't need to drill it myself (which I could). I use a wire to couple it to a solenoid that got a small supermagnet (4x1mm) glued to the core. This magnet holds the button in the depressed position; CB on.
If I apply current to the solenoid in the right direction, it works AGAINST the magnet, and the spring of the push button switch pulls via the wire the core out of the solenoid. CB triggered. I have two contact sets available per button to sense the position and switch something else.
Diameter of the button is close to original, same is travel. I only need to make the collar and knurled nut (which I can).

[crossaint]

Regarding the font on the caps of the Cessna CBs, which are special versions made by Mechanical Products Company (mechprod.com):
It's not Arial. look for Helvetica or similar. Although it is not really relevant as there a different fonts used (I have some pictures where even on the same CB panel three fonts are used.)

[Atomic_Sheep]

Didn't include my source in my last post, this is where I read it: https://www.caa.govt.nz/Publications/Vector/Vector_2001_Issue-6_Nov-Dec.pdf

Just search "over-voltage"

I guess it's wrong then.

Well maybe not wrong... just referring to the thing you said:


No, they can't even sense the voltage. They pop if due to overvoltage the current gets too high.

[crossaint]

Yes, they "measure" the current that flows through them by heating a bimetallic element with the current that flows through it.
If there is enough current, the bimetallic element will push aside a latching element and the circuit breaker opens some contacts and the current is interrupted. Note that in most C/Bs the popping out button is not directly linked with the contacts, but uses the bimetallic element to close the circuit again. This way one can't stop the C/B from disconnecting, even if the button is kept pressed.

This has an implication for a correct simulation: It needs some time for the bimetallic element to cool down, and during this time a pushed button will not stay in and the contacts are not connected. Only if after the cool-down time the button is pushed in, the C/B is actually reset.

[_alioth_]

I didn't see this thread.
I think it is better tu put here the link with my circuit breakers panel.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7u3pdHTc8I&amp;feature=youtu.be



This has an implication for a correct simulation: It needs some time for the bimetallic element to cool down, and during this time a pushed button will not stay in and the contacts are not connected. Only if after the cool-down time the button is pushed in, the C/B is actually reset.

That's true! I will add this "function" in the arduino software to get this behavior.

Arturo.

[Atomic_Sheep]

Yes, they "measure" the current that flows through them by heating a bimetallic element with the current that flows through it.
If there is enough current, the bimetallic element will push aside a latching element and the circuit breaker opens some contacts and the current is interrupted. Note that in most C/Bs the popping out button is not directly linked with the contacts, but uses the bimetallic element to close the circuit again. This way one can't stop the C/B from disconnecting, even if the button is kept pressed.

This has an implication for a correct simulation: It needs some time for the bimetallic element to cool down, and during this time a pushed button will not stay in and the contacts are not connected. Only if after the cool-down time the button is pushed in, the C/B is actually reset.

Very interesting, wasn't aware of this, thanks for pointing it out.